Fire extinguishers

[pfarber]

Looking of a fire extinguisher as per the SNL.

The book says:

So it seems that there are two extinguishers and specific open and closed cab mounts.

The search for Pyreene model info starts.

[pfarber]

Here is what the fire extinguisher bracket on a CCKW looks like

Note that there are no feet on the bracket... its mounted flush against the panel.

Also note the tang at the top, and that there are two metal bands to hold the extinguisher in place.

It looks very similar to the 'Universal type' that was used on the jeeps.. like this one:

[pfarber]

The July 1944 Army Motors did a spread on fire extinguishers:

This shows the CLASSIC H.V.T (Heavy Vehicle Type) Pyrene, and the other two as per the TM9-1799 - Fire Gun and S.O.S. Fire Guard.

Here is my newly acquired Pyrene HVT:

Comparing the two the big differences are:

The addresses at the bottom:
WWII 'New Jersey should start almost on top of the small pyrene logo (mine has New Jersey well off to the right)
WWII The 4 addresses as 2 columns of 2 (mine has all address in a single row)


There is no way to tell color, nor if the information is on a brass plate (mine is) or decal.

Compare this information with this post from the G503:

http://www.g503.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=59161

Type I (wartime, pre-1944): Decal nomenclature with one patent. Factory O.D. painted. T handle has PAT. PEND. Five addresses (Newark New Jersey (first line) with Atlanta, Kansas City (below, left side) and Chicago, San Francisco (below, right side). No "FM" in a lozenge.

Type II (wartime, 1944-1945): Decal nomenclature with two patents. Plain/gilt brass body. T handle has PAT. PEND.. Five addresses (as above). No "FM" in a lozenge.

Type III (early postwar?): Brass tag nomenclature with two patents. Plain/gilt brass body. T handle is plain. Five addresses (as above). Slight changes in the font of the text. Has "FM" in lozenge on either side of the PYRENE logo.

Type IV (postwar?): Brass tag nomenclature with two patents. Plain/gilt brass body. T handle is plain. Five addresses but now four are on one line below the Newark address. Main address is now Newark 8 New Jersey.

[pfarber]

Here is a proper DECAL type Pyrene:





Note the address at the bottom.

The handle had PATENT PEND cast into one side of the handle. One word on each wing.

What SUCKS is that the SERIAL NUMBER has been scrapped off. If SNs are sequential that would be an excellent starting point.

[pfarber]

This is a 1940's Harley WLA extinguisher.

Note the bottom addresses: New Jersey starts over the logo, 4 addresses 2 columns of 2.

[pfarber]

Here is a reproduction decal (ink jet)

The addresses at the bottom seem correct, but the wording at the top.. the fonts are muddy/fuzzy because its an inkjet print.

[pfarber]

Switching to the FIRE GUN No. 0

Here is what typically shows up and whats in Army Motors

JRfiregun.JPG (24.81 KiB) Viewed 10856 times

While the text APPEARS IDENTICAL there is some question at to what areas should be light vs dark.

[pfarber]

Here is the TM image of the same Fire Gun. Note the two brass Fire Guns ARE NOT correct!

Note that the Fire Gun logo at the top is enclosed in its own rectangle.
Note that the 'To Operate' text (with the black background is ALSO the top of another lined box that encloses all the text to the bottom of the decal (for lack of a better word).

So the layout is:

Box with logo and text
'Extinguishes Fires' is it unboxed
'To Operate' (with the black background) is the top of a new line box that encompasses the rest of the text.

My guess would be that this is a decal?

Look again... the color of some of the text blocks is 'backwards' and the double boarder line is clear.

[pfarber]

I bet the folks that run Pyrene Company in Canada get a boatload of letters..

http://www.pyrene.ca/


Contact Us

If you require any of the services or products that we provide, please contact us below. Unfortunately, we cannot provide any information regarding antique fire extinguishers as we are not the original manufacturer of these products.

You would think that they might have *something* (the probably have something that references the older models... even if its just contact information to the original company)... heck they even use the Pyrene logo!

[pfarber]

Here is an interesting tid bit:

At one time, during and after World War II, most fire extinguishers contained Carbon Tetrachloride, an excellent fire stopper. This same chemical was also at one time used in commercial dry- cleaning establishments and within refrigeration units. Since then, however, Carbon Tetrachloride has been found to be an extremely dangerous chemical that, if inhaled or absorbed through the skin in high enough levels, can be fatal. To make things even worse, when this chemical is exposed to heat, the toxicity level inherently increases to produce phosgene, a dangerous corrosive ga--also known as "nerve gas."

These extinguishers were recalled in the late 1950s when scientists discovered just how dangerous Carbon Tetrachloride can be.


So Carbon Tet extinguishers went away by the 1960's. So that puts a 'top end' to the pyrene carbon tet line.

So, following up on something I read elsewhere was to get the patent dates of the 2 patents on what the 'wartime correct' pyrene.

US Patent 2347548 was applied for in April, 1942 (Patent Pend) and was granted in April 25th, 1944. So the two patent number don't AUTOMATICALLY disqualify it as a 'war time' unit. The patent itself was for a vent in the handle to prevent corrosion.

US Patent 1688195 was for the specific double action pump and was applied for in Oct 6th, 1925, Granted October 16th, 1928... so the first patent should always be there, and not in a Pat. Pend status.

The last discrepancy of war time and post was is the Newark New Jersey address changing to Newark 8 New Jersey.

So what does Newark 8 New Jersey mean?

http://www.coxsackie.com/reference/btc.htm
"Postal zones were first used on May 1, 1943 (e.g., Los Angeles 54 or New York 16.) All large and many medium sized cities had zones. If a zone is listed you know your item dates after 1943. If no zone is listed the item might pre-date 1943. Small towns never used zones so the lack of zone means nothing. All large cities did use zones, so if the item contains a full address of a large city without a zone, the item pre-dates 1943. Unfortunately, manufacturers did not always print their full mailing address on their items. They often thought that Brooklyn NY or St. Louis Mo. was a sufficient cachet so lack of a zone could simply mean the manufacturer didn't bother to print it. Here's a research project for someone. Which cities had zones and which one's didn't? The answer can be found in the official Postal Handbooks from the 1940s and 50s (which would make a fine addition to our Center reference library!)

Zip codes replaced postal zones on July 1, 1963. All post offices, no matter how small, were assigned zip codes. So, if an item has a zip code, you know it was made after 1963. In some areas, postal zones continued to be used for some time after 1963. We have some 1965 Antiques Dealer magazines in the reference library with ads that cite postal zones rather than zip codes. But the 1963 date is a pretty good rule of thumb. "

[pfarber]

I found this tidbit from and ebay seller:

"The label has the postal zone number 8 for Newark, NJ. The USPS zone numbers started in 1943 and went to 1963 when zip codes started. After 1947, Pyrene didn't have the 8 on that label."

So its appears that the time frame might be 1943-1947. And the quote above is correct, but I think the seller meant to say "Before 1947" which is incorrect.

Well, looking at Popular Mechanics, a quick google shows a few mentions of Pyrene.

In the March, 1943 Issue page P.4A is shows this:

pyrene43PM.JPG (12.76 KiB) Viewed 10849 times

Clearly not using the Newark 8 postal zone.

[pfarber]

Closest I have found so far is the Rotarian magazine, this is from the October, 1945 issue:

Here's the full ad:

The ETO ceased hostilities in May, 1945. PTO was August 1945

With typical magazine lead time being 4-6 months you can make a VERY compelling argument that the double patent number, Newark 8 address is a wartime issue item. Its not very an iron clad case, but at least commercially the address may have been Newark 8. And since the Postal Zones were in full effect in 1943 its even more fodder for the argument.

It seems that the determining factor is actually the four lower cities. Note in the ad the cities are still 2 x 2, not a single line.

The earliest I can make out for the single line of cities at the bottom (and its a inconclusive is this) is from the June 1947 issue of Popular Mechanics:

This seems to be the same add as in the April issue of the same year. It looks like there is only one line of cities.

[pfarber]

Google books shows no other references to Pyrene in the wartime years.

Going by the Rotarian ad, it states to buy war bonds. If you look at the schedule of war bond drives:

Seventh War Loan drive: May 1945 July 1945 (six weeks starting May 14th)

Victory War Loan drive: Oct 29th 45 through Dec 8th 45.

My presumption is that the ad is referencing the Seventh War bond drive in May, so the ad and artwork submitted would be from early April/May-ish.

I'm going to say that the Newark 8 address most likely was changed in late 43 or 44 to account for the new postal regulations. So it would be correct to have a Newark 8 address AS LONG AS the cities were 2x2 and not single line.

The single line appears to be a 1947 change used until production stopped. None of the Pyrene's should have a zip code, as that started in 1963, and by 1960 carbon tet was removed from commercial products.

[pfarber]

Question was emailed that the company would not have changed the label for an address update.

Well, the CCKW dropped all mention of Yellow Coach and Cab on the later data plates. There was no real need to as YC&C was still a GM division... but they did replace with the General Motors... still took up the same amount of space.

[pfarber]

PROPER Fire GUN No.0

Army Motors 7/44	PROPER Fire Gun	Common (Improper)
AMFireGun.JPG (16.75 KiB) Viewed 10839 times		JRfiregun.JPG (24.81 KiB) Viewed 10839 times

Note that the AM and PROPER extinguishers have the "EXTINGUISHES FIRE" as black with no background, the IMPROPER one has a black background.
Note that the AM and PROPER extinguishers have the "TO OPERATE" instruction on a RED background, the IMPROPER one has no background.
Note that the AM and PROPER extinguishers have the Carbon tet and refill instructions on NO background, the IMPROPER one has a black background.
Note that the AM and PROPER extinguishers have the Underwriters Laboratory and SN with NO background, the IMPROPER one has a black background.

Well, at least the IMPROPER Fire Gun No. 0 is all shiny... I guess that counts for something.